NHL Labor Talks - NHL, NHLPA agree on 10-year CBA term

[key2win]

NHL, union to resume talks Friday in New York - Yahoo! Sports

TORONTO (AP) -- The NHL and its players' union are to resume bargaining Friday for the first time since the lockout began, although the talks will concentrate on secondary economic issues.

Deputy commissioner Bill Daly and NHL Players' Association special counsel Steve Fehr met Tuesday in Toronto and set up the session, which will be in New York. These will be the first formal negotiations since Sept. 12, when the players and owners exchanged proposals.

The lockout started Sept. 16, when training camps were to open. This is the third lockout since Gary Bettman became commissioner in 1993. The last lockout wiped out the 2004-05 season and ended when players accepted a salary cap.

With the league and union far apart on money, both sides decided to discuss other economic issues that also are necessary for an agreement. Fehr said the topics will include pension and medical plans, schedule rules, drug testing and the grievance procedure.

Top officials from the NHL and NHLPA met Monday to review last season's economics and complete escrow payments due players. The labor contract was not discussed.

''Obviously, we've got to talk before you can get a deal, so I think it's important to get the talks going again,'' Daly said Monday. ''But you also have to have something to say. I think it's fair to say we feel like we need to hear from the players' association in a meaningful way because I don't think that they've really moved off their initial proposal, which was made more than a month ago now.''

The St. Louis Blues laid off what is believed to just under 20 front-office workers, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reported Tuesday. The Florida Panthers and Ottawa Senators already have had layoffs. Other teams have said they could do so depending on how long the lockout lasts.

It took three months for the NHL and NHLPA to resume bargaining after the lockout began in 2004. Since this lockout started a handful of players have expressed concern that it could last the entire season. Detroit Red Wings forward Danny Cleary said Monday he was ''just trying to be realistic.''

The NHL has $3.3 billion in annual revenue. The league wants to reduce the players' share of hockey related revenue from 57 percent to a range between 49 percent and 47 percent, up from 43 percent in its original proposal. Players think management's alleged financial problems could be addressed by re-examining the teams' revenue-sharing formula.

[key2win]

NHL, locked-out players resume bargaining - Yahoo! Sports

NEW YORK (AP) -- The NHL and the players' association agreed on issues related to player safety and drug testing Friday, but the core economic divide that is preventing an end to the league's latest lockout was not even on the agenda.

The sides returned to the bargaining table after more than two weeks apart, and some progress was made in about two hours of discussions during a morning session.

''You would absolutely hope that things progress and kind of catch fire, but right now we're just going to take it one step at a time and try to come to an agreement on as many issues as possible,'' said former player Mathieu Schneider, now an NHLPA special assistant to the executive director. ''We're taking baby steps right now.''

NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman took part in Friday morning's talks, but union head Donald Fehr wasn't present. He joined the discussions during the afternoon.

The sides also were expected to meet on Saturday and Sunday.

''It says that both sides are committed to getting back to the table and working,'' Schneider said.

Schneider added that there were agreements on more rigorous drug testing, expanding it to parts of the year during which testing is not currently done.

Neither side sees the use of performance-enhancing drugs as a problem in the NHL.

''We're in agreement that it's not an issue in our sport,'' Schneider said. ''I think it's in the players' best interest as well as the sport to close off any possible time during the year where players could use.''

Other topics on tap for Friday and through the weekend are various health and safety issues, time players spend at training facilities, and other non-economic topics.

''We like to say that nothing is agreed to until everything is agreed to, but we've certainly made some headway,'' Schneider said. ''A lot of it was done previous to this morning. We're taking notes of where we stand. I would say that we have a lot of mutual ground that we have found agreement on.''

It is not impossible that monetary issues will come up for discussion in this round of talks, they just aren't scheduled. Neither side has indicated it is prepared to make a new offer now regarding how to split up the more than $3 billion annual pot of hockey-related revenue.

''In general, when you're dealing with collective bargaining, when you start to have agreements on smaller issues, it can lead to bigger issues,'' Schneider said, ''but it's still too early to say.''

These are the first talks since the lockout was put in place on Sept. 16 and they came a day after the league canceled the remaining preseason games. The regular season is to start Oct. 11.

[key2win]

Donald Fehr, NHL Commissioner Bettman meet again - Yahoo! Sports

NEW YORK (AP) -- The best that can be said about back-to-back days of negotiations between the NHL and the locked out players' association is that the sides are still talking and making more plans to meet yet again.

While core economic issues still weren't on the agenda Saturday when the opposing groups got together again at the NHL office, dialogue continued on secondary topics that will ultimately go toward forming a new collective bargaining agreement.

NHL Players' Association head Donald Fehr and NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman held a second round of private talks Saturday in an effort to move closer to an agreement that would end the ongoing lockout.

While negotiating teams from the union and the league discussed definitions of what makes up hockey-related revenue - the pool of money the sides are trying to figure out how to split up - Fehr and Bettman talked about the differences that are keeping the sides apart.

''I spent a few minutes with Gary talking about the overall situation, and we agreed to keep in touch,'' Fehr said Saturday. ''I am sure we will talk again (Sunday). I don't know whether will meet again (Sunday). That remains to be seen.

''I am not going to talk about the specifics, but in general we're trying to discuss how do we find a way to make an agreement. How do we bridge the gap on the major issues that are between us.''

The sides met for about four hours before finishing Saturday, and they agreed to meet again on Sunday. The agenda likely will include discussions on health and safety issues - a topic that made up a chunk of Friday's talks - and miscellaneous legal things, such as grievances, game tickets and other topics.

Clarifications as to what will fall under the umbrella of hockey-related revenue going forward in the next agreement dominated discussions Saturday. No concrete resolutions were made, and the topic could be revisited on Sunday.

''I am not sure if we have identified discrepancies,'' NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly said. ''I think the nature of what we were trying to do today was to create certainty on interpretations we've had over seven years of this CBA operation.

''These meetings are necessary but they have been described as the underbrush, and certainly they aren't the main issues that need to be tackled to get a deal.''

The sides talked for a second straight day on matters separate from the core economic issues that ultimately will have to be hammered out. In the recently expired collective bargaining agreement between the league and the union, the players received a 57 percent share of hockey-related revenue.

The NHL wants to cut the number down to under 50 percent in the new deal. The league imposed a lockout on Sept. 16, when the previous agreement ran out, and the sides didn't meet again until Friday.

''Their position on the big stuff has been that a major move consists of changing the players' share from a reduction of 24 percent to 17 1/2 percent,'' Fehr said. ''Our initial proposal made a move in their direction. We have amplified that by giving them several different ideas to consider about how to lengthen the agreement to how to be more in line with what they wanted.''

Fehr said discussing what exactly makes up hockey-related revenue is significant, because that will determine how much money is there to be divided.

''Today was mainly on HRR issues: definitions, clarifications and so forth,'' NHL Players' Association special counsel Steve Fehr said. ''We had a frank exchange of views. We each expressed our positions in terms of some potential changes and how we thought the current agreement was working.''

He wasn't ready to call Saturday's meeting a reason for optimism yet.

''It's a positive thing that we are talking when we weren't talking for some time,'' he said. ''We could be talking about other things, so I'm not sure I'd go there.

''We're continuing the dialogue. It's very much an up-and-down process, so it's hard to say. It's good that we're talking and we're going to talk again tomorrow, hopefully for quite a while.''

Some progress was made on Friday on secondary issues related to player safety and drug testing, areas that weren't expected to be contentious. The league and union held two sessions then that totaled about five hours and included an initial meeting between Bettman and Fehr.

At least they got back to talking - which hadn't happened since a few days before the NHL locked out its players.

All of the issues, big and small, must be ironed out before hockey can get out of the board room and back on the ice. So while the divisive topics still need to be tackled, the smaller ones have to be worked on, too.

The sides still aren't moving closer to a compromise while they talk about other issues.

And that is where the frustration lies. The NHL is waiting for the players' association to make a counterproposal to one the league made in the previous bargaining session more than two weeks ago.

The NHL contends it has stated its position and needs the players' association to make what the league would consider a meaningful counter.

''The whole process is a bit complicated when you're trying to define revenue streams and what should be in and what should be out (of hockey-related revenue),'' Steve Fehr said. ''It's a bit complicated between the fact that their most recent economic offer says they will go back to the current definitions, yet they are seeking some changes or clarifications in what the current definitions are.''

Monetary issues are not expected to come up for discussion in this round of talks. Neither side has indicated it is prepared to make a new offer now regarding how to split up the more than $3 billion annual pot of hockey-related revenue.

Saturday's talks came two days after the league canceled the remaining preseason games. The regular season is scheduled to start on Oct. 11.

If a deal isn't reached soon, regular-season games will be in danger of being lost. The NHL canceled the entire 2004-05 season because of a lockout that eventually led to the collective bargaining agreement that expired this month.

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NHL labor talks set to resume Tuesday - Yahoo! Sports

NHL labor talks will resume Tuesday morning, with both sides still focusing on secondary matters and not the core economic issues that continue to divide owners and players in a league-imposed lockout entering its third week.

The NHL confirmed on Monday that talks were set to resume in New York.

Negotiators for the league and NHL Players' Association are expected to pick up where they left off after Sunday, when they completed three straight days of discussions. The talks focused on secondary issues, such as what should define hockey-related revenue, as well as player health and safety.

Though both sides have made progress during the latest series of discussions, they've failed to make much of a dent in determining how to split up more than $3 billion in league revenues between owners and players.

No further talks are currently scheduled beyond Tuesday.

The NHL locked out the players after the collective bargaining agreement expired on Sept. 15, and has since canceled its entire preseason schedule. The next step is expected to come this week, when the NHL is anticipated to announce the postponement of the start of the regular season, which was scheduled to open on Oct. 11.

The NHL dispute is now attracting the attention of two New Jersey senators, who are urging both sides to settle.

U.S. Sens. Frank Lautenberg and Robert Menendez sent a letter Monday to NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman and NHLPA executive director Don Fehr urging them to consider the economic impact on their state if the dispute is not resolved.

The Democrats wrote that Congress has jurisdiction over interstate commerce, which includes professional sports, and will be keeping a ''close eye'' on negotiations.

The letter warned that the absence of New Jersey Devils' games in Newark could mean millions of dollars in lost economic activity and jobs in especially tough economic times. The Devils advanced to the Stanley Cup Finals last season, creating a financial boost to the city just five months ago.

The lockout comes on the heels of the NBA's Nets moving from Newark to Brooklyn, N.Y.

[ocanseco55]

I hope they can get this together.. the fans deserve better!

[key2win]

NHL: We're still waiting for new union proposal - Yahoo! Sports

NEW YORK (AP) -- The rhetoric is rising, while the time before the planned start of the NHL regular season is running out.

And now it seems more likely than not that regular-season games will be canceled before the league and the players' association even get back to the negotiating table.

The sides broke off talks Tuesday after just two hours, and it was hard to find optimism anywhere that the season would avoid a major disruption - just seven years after a full season was lost to a lockout.

''Not prepared to speculate on next steps at this point,'' NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly told The Associated Press in an email on Wednesday. ''Obviously, we've been saying for over a month now that we would welcome a new proposal from the Players' Association. That continues to be our position.

''(It's) not a constructive position to say, 'Here's our first offer. We think it's really good. Call us back when you are ready to accept it.' That's what the union has effectively done here.''

Daly also said on Wednesday that the NHL has no timetable when it will start calling off regular-season games.

The season is slated to open on Oct. 11. But with training camps on hold and all preseason games already canceled, it is hard to imagine the NHL can stick to that schedule if a deal with the players' association isn't reached in the next day or two.

With no new negotiations scheduled, that seems to be nearly impossible.

''Unfortunately, the NHL's negotiation strategy was to lock out the players as a strategy of first resort,'' NHLPA special counsel Steve Fehr told the AP on Wednesday in an email. ''After massive player concessions during the last round of CBA negotiations, followed by seven years of record NHL revenues, the league is once again seeking enormous reductions in players' salaries, along with significant changes which would limit individual player rights.

''The players have made multiple proposals that are favorable to the owners. The owners have not made a single proposal which would give the players anything meaningful. In fact, for much of September the owners did not even want to meet unless it was on their terms.''

When the sides got together on Tuesday, for the fourth time in five days, they again focused their talks on secondary issues and not the core economics that have the NHL and the union at odds.

With little to actually discuss, the meeting broke up relatively quickly and left both groups frustrated.

Daly said the league has already lost $100 million in revenues from lost preseason games. The sides are fighting about how to divide up over $3 billion in hockey-related revenues. Players received 57 percent of that pot in the previous collective bargaining agreement, and the NHL wants that number to drop under 50 percent in the new deal.

Players have offered to take a smaller cut as long as there is more revenue sharing between the richer and poorer franchises.

When Daly left the latest negotiating session, he said it ''was not overly encouraging.''

''We are closer by definition (to canceling regular season games),'' he added. ''We are focused on minimizing the damage.''

Players' Association Executive Director Donald Fehr contends that the union has made proposals that move closer to the NHL's position, and that the league has moved further away from the players.

Steve Fehr disputed Daly's assessment that progress wasn't made on Tuesday.

''Talks can resume anytime they're ready,'' he said.

[ocanseco55]

I hope the get it together soon.. they are going to lose alot of cash with the doors closed..

[key2win]

NHL lockout forces canceled games through Oct. 24 - Yahoo! Sports

NEW YORK (AP) -- What seemed inevitable for the NHL has become reality. The league canceled the first two weeks of the regular season on Thursday, the second time games have been lost because of a lockout in seven years.

The announcement was made in a two-paragraph statement. It isn't clear if those games will be made up, allowing for a complete 82-game regular season, if a deal can be struck soon with the locked-out players.

Unable to work out how to split up $3 billion in hockey-related revenues with the players' association, the NHL wiped out 82 games from Oct. 11-24 - beginning with four next Thursday, which would have been the league's opening night.

''We were extremely disappointed to have to make today's announcement,'' NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly said in a statement. ''The game deserves better, the fans deserve better, and the people who derive income from their connection to the NHL deserve better.

''We remain committed to doing everything in our power to forge an agreement that is fair to the players, fair to the teams, and good for our fans. This is not about 'winning' or 'losing' a negotiation. This is about finding a solution that preserves the long-term health and stability of the league and the game. We are committed to getting this done.''

The union countered Thursday by saying the NHL forced the lockout onto the players instead of letting the season go on as planned.

''The decision to cancel the first two weeks of the NHL season is the unilateral choice of the NHL owners,'' NHLPA Executive Director Donald Fehr said in a statement. ''If the owners truly cared about the game and the fans, they would lift the lockout and allow the season to begin on time while negotiations continue.

''A lockout should be the last resort in bargaining, not the strategy of first resort,'' he added. ''For nearly 20 years, the owners have elected to lock out the players in an effort to secure massive concessions. Nevertheless, the players remain committed to playing hockey while the parties work to reach a deal that is fair for both sides. We hope we will soon have a willing negotiating partner.''

Although there have been negotiations between the league and players in recent days - unlike a three-month break at the start of the 2004-05 lockout that forced the cancellation of the entire season - the two sides haven't gotten any closer to a deal on core economic issues.

''Obviously, (cancellations) might have been expected but it's also disappointing because we set out to negotiate,'' New York Rangers goalie Martin Biron said in a telephone interview. ''We wanted to get a deal and wanted to avoid a work stoppage or any cancellations.

''We're still working hard to find a solution and find a way to get the core economic stuff figured out with the league and getting a deal that is fair for everybody and lasts.''

In the previous lockout, the NHL and the union didn't get together between early September and early December.

Back then, the key words in the negotiations were salary cap, linkage and cost certainty. Commissioner Gary Bettman and the owners were committed to getting a deal that linked team costs to revenues, so each club would know exactly how much it had to spend on payroll and what number it couldn't exceed.

Thus a salary cap was born for the first time in NHL history. The league produced record revenue during the seven years of that deal, which turned out much better for the players than expected.

There are no major philosophical issues this time as there were with the salary cap fight, but the sides are far apart in financial figures. Players received 57 percent of hockey-related revenue in the deal that expired Sept. 15, and the NHL wants to bring that number below 50 percent - perhaps as low as 47 percent.

The players' association, led by Fehr - the former baseball union chief - has rejected that idea.

''The leadership that we have with Don and his team is really trying to look at the big picture and not just a number,'' Biron said. ''We understand that there is some tweaking and some things that have to be fixed in our proposal, but it seems that the owners are on a one-way mission to cut salaries.''

The NHL claims the union hasn't done near enough to try to get closer to the league's proposal and appears willing to wait for the NHLPA to come around.

Daly said the league had already lost $100 million in revenues from canceled preseason games. The players will begin feeling the real sting when they don't get their first paychecks of the season on Oct. 15.

During the last lockout, Bettman followed through on his vow to cancel the season if a deal wasn't reached by a February deadline. A new collective bargaining agreement wasn't completed until July, long after major damage had been done. It marked the first time a North American professional sport lost an entire season to a labor dispute.

In 2004, Daly announced Sept. 29 that there wouldn't be any hockey in October. New proposals and negotiations in December and January did little to push the sides toward a settlement, and Bettman announced Feb. 16 that the season had been lost. It marked the first time since a flu epidemic in 1919 that the Stanley Cup wasn't awarded.

Earlier this week, U.S. Sens. Frank Lautenberg and Robert Menendez of New Jersey sent a letter to Bettman and Fehr, urging them to consider the economic impact on their state if the dispute isn't resolved.

The letter warned that the absence of New Jersey Devils' games in Newark could mean millions of dollars in lost economic activity and jobs in especially tough economic times. The Devils advanced to the Stanley Cup finals last season, creating a financial boost to the city just five months ago.

Now, the lockout comes on the heels of the NBA's Nets moving from Newark to Brooklyn, N.Y.

Lautenberg renewed his call for a settlement after the games were called off Thursday.

''This cancellation of regular-season hockey games is a blow to businesses and workers in Newark and in hockey towns across the country,'' he said in a statement. ''Local jobs and millions of dollars of economic activity are being placed at risk every day that this dispute continues.

''The NHL should keep in mind communities, workers, and families that are being hurt by its decision to pursue a lockout and cancel these games. Owners and players must find a way to start the season before the economies in Newark and other communities are further damaged.''

Fehr responded in a letter Tuesday, and offered to meet with the senators in New Jersey.

''As you observed, far too many people in Newark and other NHL cities will suffer as a result of this decision, including players,'' Fehr said in his letter, regarding the lockout. ''We are currently working with players to identify small business owners who will be affected to see what we can do during this period.

''Unfortunately, the lockout was no surprise. Months ago, the owners made public their intention to lock out the players, and they did so the first chance they legally could. There was nothing the players could have done to prevent it - other than to agree to the enormous concessions the owners demand.''

[key2win]

Sides still at odds in NHL labor talks - Yahoo! Sports

NEW YORK (AP) -- Five hours of talks in two sessions between the NHL and the players' association did little to move the sides closer to a deal in the nearly one-month lockout.

The NHL's top two executives - Commissioner Gary Bettman and Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly - met with the NHLPA's main negotiators - executive director Donald Fehr and special counsel Steve Fehr - for nearly an hour Wednesday morning to assess where the sides were on Day 25 of the NHL lockout, but there was no concrete discussions on the troublesome core economic issues preventing a deal.

A four-hour session that stretched into evening centered on player health and safety issues along with other miscellaneous legal topics. The health issues involved seeking multiple medical opinions on injuries, and who should make determinations when a player is healthy enough to return to action after being hurt.

''We have some disagreements in those areas,'' Daly said. ''When you get to this point of the discussions on some of those areas, that is to be expected so we're kind of refining some of the things we continue to have disagreements on.

''We had no discussion of the major economic issues or system issues, so that continues to be a disappointment from our perspective.''

The sides will meet again Thursday - which should have been NHL opening day - but there are still no plans to delve into how the sides will split up hockey-related revenue that was in excess of $3 billion last season.

Steve Fehr took a more optimistic view of what was discussed Wednesday, but lamented that the discussions were taking place instead of action on the ice.

''You often don't know whether you're making progress until you look back on it,'' he said. ''We were just sort of discussing the overall status of the bargaining and where the parties are.''

The NHL is eager to get a new proposal from the union on the main economic issues, but the players contend that they have moved closer to the league's demands in their previous offers while the NHL has only sought to take more away from the union in each proposal it has made.

''I think we're making progress in a number of the areas that were discussed today,'' Steve Fehr said. ''They were good discussions. It's a shame that they are going on in the midst of a lockout when we could be doing it while we're playing or we could've been doing it a month ago or two months ago.

''I wouldn't say (talks) are dead in the water. The sides are in constant communication. I think we have a pretty good sense of where each other is.''

However, Donald Fehr has floated the idea that the longer the lockout goes on, the players might seek to make an offer that doesn't include a salary cap - the very issue that led to the cancellation of the 2004-05 season. The collective bargaining agreement that finally ended that lockout seven years ago expired last month.

''None of those comments were a surprise to me,'' Daly said. ''If that is the direction they choose to go in, that's up to them. I don't make the decisions for them. They've suggested they want to get the players back on the ice soon. I can pretty much assure you if they make that proposal, it won't get the players back on the ice soon.''

If discussions can get jump-started, the sides haven't ruled out meeting again on Friday. Two weeks of the regular season have already been wiped out - at least temporarily - and if a deal isn't struck soon, more games could soon be lost.

For now, Daly and the NHL just want to hear something new from the union.

''We're trying to think of ideas to move the process forward,'' he said. ''Our message to the players' association was we're encouraging them to make a proposal. We hear, we understand that they have been working on some concepts, some ideas. We've suggested to them to just make the proposal.

''Any movement is better than no movement at all. If we move sideways, hopefully we move it forward. But even if we move backward, it might be better than where we are now.''

These were the first negotiations since the sides held an unannounced meeting in Toronto on Friday to discuss where they were and how to move the process forward.

Last week, the NHL canceled the first two weeks of the regular season, wiping out 82 games from Thursday through Oct. 24.

Daly estimated the NHL lost $100 million from the cancellation of the entire preseason and another $140 million to $150 million with the regular-season losses.

''It's unfortunate for both of us,'' he said. ''It's a significant amount of money that the players share in on a significant basis. Whatever that percentage ends up being, it's a significant basis.

''Even more disappointing from should be from our collective perspective is we felt like over the last seven years we've built up a lot of momentum in the business, we've had a lot of growth, and who knows what a work stoppage from this will do to our momentum.''

One victory was achieved by the NHL on Wednesday when the Alberta Labor Relations Board ruled that the lockout of players from the Edmonton Oilers and Calgary Flames can continue.

The board said declaring the lockout illegal in the province wouldn't help the league and its players reach a settlement. The players had argued that the Oilers and Flames are Alberta businesses and as such, must abide by provincial labor rules.

''We're disappointed, obviously,'' Steve Fehr said. ''We thought we had a strong case. It's a bit of an odd decision in that the labor board found that its powers were permissive instead of mandatory.

''They didn't say we were necessarily wrong on the law, they said they just chose not to get involved. We think that is unfortunate. We think they should've gotten involved. Obviously it's a win for the league and they get to continue the lockout they want so badly without any interference from the Alberta labor board.''

Daly said the entire case was irrelevant to the bargaining process that will be necessary to reach a deal.

''It was really a distraction to the process,'' he said. ''It wasn't good-faith bargaining. It didn't move the good-faith bargaining process forward.''

[key2win]

All quiet on hockey front 4 weeks into lockout - Yahoo! Sports

NEW YORK (AP) -- NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman still hasn't spoken to players' union chief Donald Fehr since a brief meeting Wednesday, but negotiators on both sides are back in contact as the lockout drags on.

There was no meeting Friday, after two straight days of negotiations at the league's New York office, and there are no current plans for more bargaining to take place.

''We've talked. There is nothing scheduled,'' NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly told The Associated Press in an email.

Frustration is building on both sides as the lockout approaches its fifth week. The first regular-season games were missed Thursday night - one week after the first 82 contests were wiped out - and Staples Center in Los Angeles will have to wait for the Kings' Stanley Cup championship banner to be raised to the rafters.

The Kings were supposed to honor their first title-winning club Friday night before hosting the New York Rangers.

All games through Oct. 24 have been called off, and more cuts are expected soon with no new labor deal in sight.

The sides finished two days of negotiations Thursday that again centered on secondary issues such as drug testing, contracts and other legal things, instead of talks about the core economics of the sport that is fueling the lockout.

The league and the union did little to close the gap keeping them from a deal, and the likelihood of any hockey being played in October is quickly fading.

After five hours of talks at the league office on Wednesday, the sides got back together for nearly as long - in two sessions - on Thursday.

Daly estimated the NHL lost $100 million from the cancellation of the entire preseason and would be out another $140 million to $150 million with the regular-season losses.

The NHL still says it is waiting for a new proposal from the union, with the owners adamant players accept a significant drop from the 57 percent of revenue they received under the salary cap in the last contract. The players don't want what they consider massive cuts at a time when the overall revenue pot reached record numbers ($3.3 billion) last year.

[key2win]

NHL, union might resume negotiations on Tuesday - Yahoo! Sports

Labor negotiations between the NHL and the locked-out players' association may resume Tuesday after a four-day break.

The location and the agenda have yet to be determined. The sides held two days of talks this week in New York without discussion of hockey-related revenue - the core economic issue that has prevented the NHL regular season from starting on time.

''Nothing firm. There is a potential for Tuesday,'' NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly said in an email to The Associated Press.

The 28-day lockout has already wiped out the entire preseason and the first three days of the regular season. The NHL announced last week that all games have been canceled through Oct. 24.

A deal will have to be struck soon to prevent more cancellations and provide an opportunity to make up the lost games and have a full 82-game season.

The sides finished two days of negotiations Thursday that again centered on secondary issues such as drug testing instead of focusing on how to divide up revenue.

The league and the union did little to close the gap, and the likelihood of any hockey being played in October is quickly fading. After five hours of talks at the league office on Wednesday, the sides got back together for nearly as long - in two sessions - on Thursday.

Daly estimated the NHL lost $100 million from the cancellation of the entire preseason and would be out another $140 million to $150 million with the regular-season losses.

The NHL still says it is waiting for a new proposal from the union, with the owners adamant players accept a significant drop from the 57 percent of revenue they received under the salary cap in the last contract. The players don't want what they consider more massive cuts at a time when the overall revenue pot reached record numbers ($3.3 billion) last year.

[key2win]

Bettman, NHL make new offer in hope of full season - Yahoo! Sports

TORONTO (AP) -- The stalled talks between the NHL and the players' association finally got a jumpstart.

After watching 34 days pass without a new proposal being offered from either side in negotiations for a new collective bargaining agreement, Commissioner Gary Bettman made a new offer to the NHLPA that proposes a 50-50 split of hockey-related revenue and a full 82-game season starting Nov. 2.

As talks resumed for the first time since last week between the league and the union, Bettman proudly announced the offer, which is crafted for - if nothing else - a quick response from the head of the players' association, Donald Fehr, followed by some serious negotiations either here or in New York.

''It was done,'' Bettman said, ''in the spirit of getting a deal done.''

Fehr told reporters that the proposal is for six years. Bettman did not confirm that number.

''Our hope,'' he said, ''after we review this is that there will be a feeling on the players' side that this will be a proposal from which we can negotiate and try and reach a conclusion.''

When asked if the new proposal was an improvement over previous offers made by the NHL, Fehr said: ''In some respects I think it is. In other respects, I'm not sure. We have to look at it.''

The NHL locked out its players on Sept. 15, and the regular season was scheduled to begin on Oct. 11. A Nov. 2 start date would extend the season well into June, but would preserve some of the marquee events, such as the Jan. 1 Winter Classic in Michigan.

''I don't want to get into the substance other than to say we believe that this was a fair offer for a long-term deal, and it's one that we hope gets a positive reaction,'' Bettman said. ''We have about nine or ten days to get this all put to bed, signed, sealed and delivered, in order for this offer to be effective and for us to move forward.''

Bettman said the long-term deal takes steps to guarantee the players will get full value from their existing deals. And in order to pull off the logistics of the schedule, each team would have one additional game every five weeks in order to get a full season in.

''Gary indicated to me and I assume he indicated to you that they would like to get a full 82-game season in,'' Fehr said. ''We, of course, share that view and would like to get a full 82-game season in. But, we are not in a position to make any comments about it beyond that at this point.''

All teams would also hold a makeshift training camp, lasting approximately one week. Veteran players who signed contracts overseas would need to scramble back to their team headquarters, as will the younger players who are working in the minor leagues, like the AHL, this month.

It is clearly the best offer - or counteroffer, for that matter - that has been made in the months of negotiations since last season ended in June. And the proposal is now in the hands of Fehr and his team of executives, who acknowledged that the proposal was stronger than the previous ones the union had received.

''We're going to be on-call to them. They have some work to do internally. Obviously, we didn't put this proposal, this offer, together overnight, and they're going to need a little time to review it,'' Bettman said. ''I'm hoping that review will get us to a positive and constructive place.''

To that end, the union has formally requested time to look the proposal over.

''We're focused on getting the puck dropped on Nov. 2 and playing a full 82-game regular season and full playoffs,'' Bettman said. ''That's what this offer is all about.''

This is the third lockout under Bettman's watch, but unlike the previous two, dialogue has remained steady. The two sides last met last week in New York.

''We've given it,'' Bettman said, ''our best shot.''

And at the least, Fehr is encouraged.

''I would like to believe that it will be an excellent starting point,'' he said. ''And we can go forward and see if there is a deal to be made.''

[key2win]

NHL rejects three NHLPA offers - Yahoo! Sports

NHL commissioner Gary Bettman came to the microphone after meeting with the NHL Players’ Association Thursday afternoon and if you looked closely enough, you could see traces of smoke coming out of his ears.

No matter how dire the circumstances, no matter how much pressure is being applied, Bettman almost never gets flustered. In his Bettman biography, The Instigator, Jonathan Gatehouse tells a story of how Bettman was participating in a conference call from his car while working for the NBA. His car hit some ice and as he careened off the road at full speed, he calmly informed his colleagues, “I think you’re going to hear a crash in a moment.”

As talks with the NHLPA that began with so much optimism flew off the rails so dramatically Thursday afternoon, there was no such serenity being displayed by Bettman, who was visibly disturbed by the turn of events. All of that coincided with NHLPA executive Donald Fehr showing his very sharp teeth for the first time since taking over the hockey union. There was no shortage of sniping from both heads of state, who were flanked by their most powerful allies on the ownership and player sides. And two days after it looked like there would be a sliver of hope, both Bettman and Fehr look as though they’re perfectly content to dig their heels in on their principles.

There were a dizzying array of numbers tossed around by both sides, but the bottom line is this – the NHL wants to achieve a 50-50 split in revenues with the players before the next puck is dropped. The players are willing to do their part, but want no part of having the salaries on existing contracts cut by even one penny.

“It’s clear we’re not talking the same language,” said Bettman, uttering the kind of rhetoric nobody likes to hear in a dispute. “The proposal that was made today, things are not progressing. To the contrary - the proposal that was made by the players’ association was a step backward.”

The players presented the owners with three different models they claimed would eventually get the league down to a 50-50 split in revenues and ensure the players who are signed would receive the full value of their contracts. But Fehr said the league dismissed all of them in record time.

“After the proposal was made, they did what they’ve done before,” Fehr said. “They take a very few minutes - they don’t think about it very much, they don’t analyze it, they don’t talk to the other owners, they don’t do anything. They take less than 10 minutes, maybe it was 15…and we are told two things. All three proposals are rejected in their entirety and secondly, the proposal we recently got is their best offer.

“If you had been in the room, the vibe you got in the room was, ‘If you’re not going to sign, don’t bother us.’ ”

Fehr questioned why the league would table its so-called best offer four weeks into a lockout, and it’s a legitimate question. The players are also wondering who in their right minds would take a reduction in pay for a contract into which both sides supposedly entered into in good faith. Again, another excellent point. The players are clearly occupying the higher moral ground here, but the only problem with that is, it’s not getting any of them one iota closer to playing hockey.

The owners, meanwhile, are not making a single concession here. Everything they’re proposing is a claw back from the players. Or as Shane Doan of the Phoenix Coyotes put it, “When people ask for money, they usually say, ‘Give me your money or I’m going to hurt you.’ They don’t say, ‘Give me your money and I’m going to hurt you.’ ”

But just because they’ve messed up their beds in previous collective bargaining agreements doesn’t mean they don’t have the right to try to get a deal that corrects their mistakes and saves them from themselves. And all of you out there who are saying, ‘I don’t care about the numbers, get a deal done,’ should realize the league has done exactly that in the past to get the game back on the ice and created problems for itself every time.

The NHLPA offered three options, the first of which would have had the owners and players sharing 50 percent of revenues by the third year of the deal, based on an annual growth of 7.2 percent. If that growth was more dramatic, the 50-50 split would happen more quickly. The players claim the option would save the owners $800 million if revenues grow five percent and $1.1 billion if they grow 7.2 percent.

The second option would have achieved the 50-50 split by the fifth year of the deal by basically giving the players a total of $1.833 billion - which is what they received last year - plus 24.7 percent of new revenues until the 50-50 split is achieved. They said the league would save $854 million with five percent growth, $1.06 billion with 7.2 percent growth.

The third option would propose an immediate 50-50 split, provided all contracts signed before the lockout are paid in full. A 50-50 split in revenues would account for a 13 percent cut in players’ salaries, so that 13 percent would be put aside and paid to the players, with the other 87 percent being subject to the salary cap and the 50-50 split. This would also, the players say, get the league to the 50-50 split in Year 5 of the agreement as current contracts expire.

Fehr acknowledged the third proposal was a late one and the NHLPA didn’t have time to run the numbers, but the league immediately put out a release saying the deal starts out with the players receiving between 56 and 57 percent of the revenues and does not get down to 50-50 in the five years of the deal.

This is going to get nasty now. The league, which is obviously much more concerned with currying public favor, had its commissioner stand in front of the world and tell everyone that the offer it made Tuesday was its absolute best offer. “We gave the players’ association what we had to give,” he said.

That’s rich. At the very least, it’s a curious time to put all your cards on the table. And as Fehr points out, an offer full of concessions after seven years of record growth is not all the league has to give. And that’s why he’s been able to convince the players this is a bad deal for them.

“Today is not a good day,” Fehr said. “It should have been, but it wasn’t.”

[key2win]

NHL cancels games through Nov. 1 - Yahoo! Sports

NEW YORK (AP) -- The NHL wiped out the third week of the regular season Friday as the lockout dragged on, leaving no more wiggle room if the league hopes to play a full 82-game schedule.

A day after the NHL turned down three counterproposals from players, the league canceled 53 more games. A total of 135 games through Nov. 1 have been scratched, which amounts to 11 percent of the season.

''As expected,'' New York Rangers goalie Martin Biron told The Associated Press in a text message. ''We continue to work hard to find an agreement and get back to playing hockey.''

In its third lockout since 1994, the NHL is sticking to its most recent proposal that stated a full 82-game-per-team schedule could be played if the season begins by Nov. 2. The league says a deal must be reached with the union by next Thursday for that to happen.

Two weeks ago, the league called off 82 games from Oct. 11-24.

On Thursday, the union rejected the NHL's proposal made two days earlier that offered a 50-50 split of hockey-related revenues and ensured a full regular-season schedule. In brief talks, the players countered with their trio of offers that were, in turn, quickly dismissed by the league.

''We are disappointed that the NHL has canceled more games as a result of the owners' lockout,'' said former player Mathieu Schneider, now the NHLPA special assistant to the executive director. ''The players made another major move in the negotiations this week in an effort to end the lockout, by presenting the owners with a proposal that gets to a 50-50 split of revenues.

''In return, we expect that owners will honor the current contracts they have already signed, which everyone knows is fair.''

[whitney777]

This is ugly.